Put A Quarter In It Podcast
We will be discussing all things in the world of energy healing. All the healers, the initiatives, the seers, the readers, the channelers, the ministers, the crystal workers, the empaths, the physicists, the teachers, the authors, the visionaries, the sages and of course the prophets, that converge in this glorious world of subtle energy exploration is extraordinary. The inspiration for this podcast comes from years of listening to the brilliance of my friends, Dr. Sara Allen and Debra Hurt.
The name comes from a student who was in a class that Debra and Sara were teaching. She said she loved asking a question and getting a really juicy, in depth, OVER answers to her questions. Debra and Sara really do over answer every question. This student proclaimed that she was going to bring a roll of quarters and keep feeding the juke-box to hear all the hits...she was gonna “put a quarter in it and just sit back and listen”. We thought that was really funny and it has stuck.
Put A Quarter In It Podcast
EP 22_The Great Perceiver
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More questions are raised... and answered as we continue on the subject of Liver and perception. Does perception make reality? Are the 5 Spirits what come before perception? Sara and Debra also start to offer points to help support Liver in its role as the perceiver.
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On today's episode, more questions are raised. Does perception make reality? What is true? Who drives the heart's desire? Are the five spirits what came before perception? And are we just one big AI machine? Let's hear what Sarah and Deborah have to say.
SPEAKER_02Everything on the planet is made with five things, and I'm not going to be able to name them all electrons, protons, neutrons, and atoms and h heldons, I think it is. So my car and my me are made up the same five building blocks. Right? Same physical material. Same basic material in everything on the planet. And then it has different electrons that it attracts and takes on different forms, right? You know? So there is got to be something that drives my constantly seeing that bear. Or cons or knowing, or and there's something that that when I educate myself that it is a rabbit, bears are unusual. Okay, let's just go back to this story. This this is this is this is where this is a good jumping place off for me. So that story that Donna tells when she and the girls lived in Fiji and they were all really little. Yeah. And she and the girls who came from the States would hang out on the beach with Fijians. Fijians. Fijians, yes, with the Fijians. And there was a maritime highway that big tankers, big oil tankers would take off. And so Donna and the girls would sit and watch on the beach, and they would see it was just kind of a lazy afternoon thing to watch the big tankers mow by. None of the Fijians could see it. They kept saying, We do not, we do not know what you're seeing. So Donna and the girls saw the ship. The Fijians didn't.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_02Does that mean that it, you know, if I close my eyes, there's a whole thing he has in here in Einstein and Baum, where they went back and forth over if I close my eyes, you're not real, I open eyes, you're real. Close my eyes, you're not real. And then Einstein finally said to Baum, Do you really think I'm not here when you close your eyes? And Baum said, Yes. So so we have that, so Einstein and Baum have that conversation, couldn't figure it out. Right. So the Fijians and Donna and the girls are having this conversation. So why, while Donna and the girls are living on the island, the island of Fiji had built a huge maritime dock so these big ships could come and fuel. And then after there was that in the Fijian island, within that within that frequency of their reality, then all the Fijians now saw the tankers.
SPEAKER_03There's suddenly a highway out there.
SPEAKER_02There's suddenly a highway. So those ships were traveling there. They were visible to some people where the ship was part of your reality. So did that ship exist to the Fijians? Did it didn't, but did it exist? Good question. Oh, stop that. Answer it. He existed to Donna and the girls. So here so what drove that reality? I mean, that's even bigger than, you know, so this perception that's even bigger to me. So maritime ships were realities in that Western, those Western minds. Right. And they were little. You know, they weren't big girls. They probably didn't know about big ships in the way, you know, but they saw it. It was in their collective vision. And so in that collective They were from San Diego. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01There's lots of ships. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02Lots of ships there. So so this idea that that is it there if it's not there? And and don't wouldn't that be fun to kind of figure out how to energetically do it?
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, I this is kind of a funny story from my past that illustrates the same thing. Yeah. When I was in college in San Francisco, I had a couple girlfriends who lived out in the avenues, and I would go and hang out at their place sometimes. And we would usually sit in the kitchen and and talk and get stoned. I mean, you know, it was college.
SPEAKER_02And uh, like you don't do that now. Oh, when I was in college, I smoked pot.
SPEAKER_03So we're sitting in the we're sitting in the kitchen and she says to me, What are you looking at? Really.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's a good story.
SPEAKER_03What are you looking at? I said, Oh, you never mind. And she goes, No, you're you sitting so what are you looking at? And this was not something I normally talked about with people, at least at this point. I said, Well, there's a there's a big black lab sitting over in front of the in front of the stove. And she looks at me and does not see anything there. And what are you talking about, Deb? You're crazy. There's no I said, yeah, it's not, okay. So it's not a dog, it's not a physical dog. It's uh it's like a ghost dog. I don't know, it's a spirit, but there's a dog there. And it turned into this big joke where she would make fun of me every time I was there. We'd be sitting in the kitchen, even, even not stoned. She said, Where's the dog, Deb? He's sitting by the back door. It was always in the kitchen. I never saw the dog anywhere but in the kitchen. Uh he's sitting by the back door. Sherry is. And this was this went on for for months. And I don't know what was different about this one time. Maybe we were really stoned. I don't know. Or maybe we were stoned and drinking. I don't know. But we're sitting there and we're chatting about something, and all of a sudden, I see her eyes get really big. And I know what's going on. I said, What's going on, Irene? She's like, Teb, I see the dog. So, where's the dog? She's over there by the pantry. I said, Yeah, yeah, I see him too. But no, no, you don't understand. I see the dog. I see the dog, Deb. I said, Yeah, the dog's the dog's always there. You know this. No, no. So this it was the same thing. It was like suddenly it was in it was in the field of vision where it wasn't before. Right.
SPEAKER_02So Yeah, yeah. The scales fall from the eyes. So what's a scale in liver? I mean, what's what's the what's the what's the source of the word for scale? Like when we talk about and why are they on your eyes? I've never heard of scale on an eye. It's scripture, right?
SPEAKER_03Well, isn't it? It is scripture. Yeah. Scales fall from the eye. Scales fall from the eyes. But there is also that that thing about the um the snake and the snake in its act of transformation. It when it's losing when it's shedding its skin and it's it's like wiggling out of that skin, there is a period of time after after the eyelids are gone where they're blind shortly. So and then they see again and they're transformed and they can grow. So I think it might have something to do with it.
SPEAKER_02It literally is in in a snake, I I just know this because I I like snakes.
SPEAKER_03Oh, yeah, you probably know a lot more snakes that are.
SPEAKER_02I know a lot more snakes, but when they shed their skin, their eyeballs are growing too. So they they shed they shed that skin. So that's going two. So they get really blind, they get cloudy, they look like they have cataracts. And then when they shed that skin, the eyes are clear again.
SPEAKER_00Aaron Ross Powell So what I'd be curious to know is what happened why was it that your friend I mean I we understand why the Fijians saw the ships, but why all of a sudden did your friend see the dog? Why did her scales fall off?
SPEAKER_03You know, that's a really good question. And I don't know if it was induced by some other substance. I don't remember that. I don't remember. Or if it was simply the repetition of where's the dog? Right. So it was a repetition. She was she was looking around the room expecting not to see the dog. And every time I would be able to produce the dog in a location because I could see him. So I wonder if it just at some point that just flipped for her where she could also see the dog. And the scales fell from her eyes for some reason. Yeah. Well, scale comes from Proto-Germanic scala, meaning to split or divide. Or Proto-Indo-European root scale to cut.
SPEAKER_02So this whole idea so okay, so then we're going, you know, bad B movie matrix, that kind of stuff. So if we create our own reality, so if we start to go down that little rabbit hole for a second, just a second, because that's what he says. I mean, David Haw, as I raised the book on a podcast like an idiot, um Donald Hoffman.
SPEAKER_03We expect them to be able to see us as we as we do that. At some point, maybe we could do that. Oh dear God, no.
SPEAKER_00I thought I'd broach it.
SPEAKER_02So here's here's the subtitle to his book. So the book is called The Case Against Reality. That's the big title. Right. The little tiny title is How Evolution Hid the Truth from Our Eyes. So is it the arrow that we're looking for truth? Or are we looking for is?
SPEAKER_03Well, I think where we get into trouble is when we start arguing about the about the truth. You know, putting pitting one perception against another as if as if they have intrinsic truth. Uh or not intrinsic truth, but absolute truth, that our that our perception is absolute truth.
SPEAKER_02So so we're looking for what is true, right? I mean, I think that's isn't that the con I mean, don't we still don't our bodies go when we feel like we found the truth? Well, that does belong to Wood. And I, you know, in truth, what's true? You know, I I I you know, I again I I I I want to be really practical, but I feel like I feel like just treating the organs is I feel like I'm in that Lonnie thing where he talks about, well, we have the three kinds of medicines. Right. You know, like we're talking about healing the body, then we're talking about healing the motions, and then we're talking about healing the spirit. Right. And I cannot not go to know who is driving the heart's desire, who comes before perception. Because there's something driving perception.
SPEAKER_03The will and intent of heaven.
SPEAKER_02The will and intent of heaven. But what Hoffman would say is there's no such thing as a driver. We are just big AI machines. You know, that just keep keep filling in the blanks. We have, we have it, we have a teeny tiny, we can access with our brains as big as much, as much space as our bodies give our sight, we still only see about a dime of physiology, of nature. And then he says, and he's got all kinds of things as but then it fills it in. It just draws the pictures like an AI thing. So the perceptions and how you feel, like like when he starts this lecture, he he talk, he opens the book and he starts this lecture. And I think I've done this before in a podcast, but I'm gonna say it again, Jill. What I love about the story, so there was a beetle in Australia. And I'm gonna see if I can find the name of the beetle.
SPEAKER_00I don't think it was a podcast, but you did do it in uh a class. Okay, in a class.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So there was was the beetle, and it and when you see the pictures, and he has on a website, and when he does this lecture on Ted, he has these big pictures of the beetle. And the beetle is really gorgeous. It's shiny, iridescent, coppery, bronzy, gold y. It's a gorgeous beetle. And the Australians have, they call them Bubbies or Stubbies?
SPEAKER_00Stubbies, stubbies, oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Stubbies. They're they have um the Australians love their beer. And so they're in the, and this is in the this beetle's in the outback. And there's a really famous beer in the outback that comes in a bottle that is the exact same color as this beetle. So you see these brown bottles, you know. Um I buy I can buy them in the States, you know, they're kind of shiny, they're iridescent, they're coppery, they're goldy, they're bronzy. And when they lay in the sun, and so they they would just throw the bottles out onto the into the desert, and the beetle would come along, and the beetle would hump the bottle. So the beetle was humping the bottles instead of females because it thought so so Hoffman is saying, clearly vision is not everything. That's what he was saying. So he's saying, even though 30% is visual, he said, so this beetle was humping this bottle and it was humping him, humping the beetles into extinction. So, and just a sideline, uh so as a as a further um insult to injury, there is a special little ant that specially likes to eat this particular beetle's dong. So the beetle has a dong, and when the beetle mates with another female beetle, he has to pull his dong in really fast because the ants come to the courting and they're waiting for beetle dong. So they like to eat it. Well, it's a delicacy. Because he's humping the bottle, it's not getting and it's nothing's happening. So his dong is out and all the ants are there. So not only is he humping himself into extinction, the ants are eating them into extinction. Right. Because they're humping bottles and leaving their dongs out. They're not pulling them in because they're not getting done. Okay, got it? Okay. All right. More the about beetle Australian beetle sex than you ever wanted to know. So I'm reading this book and listening to this lecture and fast you know, fascinated. And so he said, so clearly vision is not what it's survival of the fittest. I mean, these beetles were, you know, they're they're humping themselves because they saw they perceived incorrectly. Right. So what happened in Australia? The Australians heard about the the beetles humping the bottles and felt sad for them, getting their little dicks chewed off by the ants. So what they did.
SPEAKER_03That was probably the real motivator.
SPEAKER_02Australia. Yeah, those Outback men. So in Australia, what they did is they just changed the color of the bottles. They stopped making these brown bottles, these brown sparkly bottles, and the beetles restored themselves. So here's what I heard in that. So our perception is wrong. We're humping the bottle. We're being eaten by our little genitals are being eaten by ants. We're not having any success. We're not, we're not, we have no future. It's a dire situation. And then what David Hoffman calls koala. I keep holding the book up on the podcast. I don't know why I'm doing that.
SPEAKER_01There's only two people here, and they know I have the book, but I keep having Look, look, look, what the fuck is wrong with me?
SPEAKER_00You're a teacher. You're a teacher, Sarah. You're just always teaching.
SPEAKER_02So, okay, so okay. So the dick's getting eaten off by the little ants. And so the Australians stopped making the bottles, and the beetles are well. So I'm listening to the story and I'm like, okay. The beetle did not find his way, did not hear his heart. He did not go to, you know, he doesn't have the all that intelligence that we do. So the sentient being that has the intelligence. He had beer goggles. He had beer goggles on totally. You're a big one. You're a big girl. Whoa, you're a big girl. Dude, I'm a big girl, like big girls.
SPEAKER_00And here we go.
SPEAKER_02So but so okay, okay. I'm getting serious again. I'm getting okay. I'm getting serious. So there was spirit. There was a spirit that saw the beetle, that took an action, that went through the control cycle, that went through the creation cycle, that saw this happening and came in and changed the fate of this particular species. That is what I'm talking about. What drives that? And I believe that are the five spirits. Amen system. They precede, because the spirits, they precede the organs, they precede the elements. They precede the perception. They precede the perception. So in the shamanic belief, that ancient shamanic belief that is the five spirits, is that the spirits the energy of the spirit form the organ, and the energy of the organ formed the physiology. So there is uh in in uh in Chinese shamanism, there is something that precedes all that. And it's a finer energy, it's a more subtle energy than the five elements, it's a more subtle energy than the senses. But it is definitely what drives the senses to see, taste, hear, touch, and smell. So like to mom five, yeah. So if you start to master that subtle energy, you start to master perceptions and what they do because it is physics, so an electron. So when we talk about a reality, and this is what's so fun when you're talking about Hoffman, everything is developing now. And now. And now nothing, you know, in Saiqing, nothing stays the same. There's this constant movement, this constant movement, and there is no nothing static, nothing static, nothing static. Stasis is death. Stasis is death. And even that isn't. Even that isn't either. I mean, something's eaten you or you're you know, yeah. So you know, that that idea that there is always this renewal. And so when you get into the reality idea and you get behind the senses, if you understand the senses are perceiving what is going to accelerate the purpose of why I'm here, and we get into that destiny thing, the senses will create an organ for that process. So the senses precede, and the senses precede the the concept of a smell, they precede the concept of something on your tongue that comes before you put the thing on your tongue, the spirit drew that thing to your tongue, the spirit drew that thing to your vision, the spirit drew that thing to your nose to inform you on how to create the reality. So my radical statement is your senses create the reality. And if you master your senses, you create your physiology, you create your relationships, you create your wardrobe, you create so if you master the senses, because I don't think reality is here in that in the next second. I think I'm creating it. Right. And recreating it. And recreated it and recreated it. And when you study the physics, holy shit, it it there is there is nothing but the now. So the idea that every second is being created, and that's the reality. So what Hoffman says in the brain, the brain will create spots that you can rely on physical things. So I got this from a book on grief. It's called The Neuroscience of Grief. Fabulous book. Don't know the author by heart, but it's a book written by neuroscientists, and I believe it's a, I believe it's one of them is a brain surgeon. But they wrote the book to explain what happens to the brain when it goes through grief, and it was not meant to be a comfort to people. I bought it thinking it would be comforting to me. But just hearing about the science of what happens to your mind when you grieve comforted me. You know, so there was, but but they even talk about, they had this line in there when people see their dead relative. Like there was one case history in there where a young woman, she was about 25 years old, just wrote the son rose and set on her dad, and her dad died. And his thing was he always had a red bandana on his head, a black Harley, and he drove a big Harley. So she thought she was, and she ended up on somebody's couch because she kept seeing her dad. Like she'd pull up to a stop sign and look, and there he'd be, you know, or she'd see him go down the road, and it was her dad. It wasn't a guy with a red bandana, it was her dad. So they put her on in an N MRI. And they looked at her brain, and there's spots in your brain where you create things. And then there's a spot in your brain where you imagine things. And grief is a process neurologically from taking from where you place things to where you imagine things. So it's moving that. So they use the example that your dining room table, even in the dark, you know where it's at, right? And you're you're gonna walk into that kitchen and you're not gonna run into that table because you have, even though you can't see a thing, you know where it's at. So they take away the dining room table and people will still walk around like there's no like the table's there. So after a while, when you have lots of visual confirmation that that table is not there, then they see the brain move the table from the spatial spot to the imaginary spot. So that's the process of grief. Oh, interesting. So the idea that we have a part of our brain, and this is what Hoffman is talking about, that we have a part of our brain that actually designs, you know, takes a little bit of information and then it fills in all the blanks. So that process of moving from here to here, they say that's grief, which I think is fascinating to me.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So to move, to move that person from the real space, which would be where your di the part of your brain that knows where your dining room table is, to the part of your brain where you remember their dining room table used to be there.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_02So that's a painful process, but the brain does that. So the brain is creating that person still, even though they're not there. So put that in your pipe and smoke it. That's cool. So that's what he's saying. That this is that we that that everything is manufactured. What we see that we have agreed upon realities, we have we have con collaborative realities, but clearly the physi the Fijians did not agree with the Western mind that there were ships. They hadn't had that agreement.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_02So that process, that motivation behind that, you know, what I'm creating, you know, the dining room table I'm creating in my brain, or the man I'm, you know, that might, you know, out of the corner of my eye, you know, there's my dead dad, you know. So that process of constantly seeing that is real, but not reality. And the damage to the tissue of misperception is where I get involved in it, where I want to help people perceive correctly. Right. So what if I could perceive correctly from the beginning and not make those mistakes? You know, not you know, so it was, I believe it was an incor the brain was incorrect in making her dad still there, correct?
SPEAKER_03I mean uh she hadn't moved him to the imaginary spot.
SPEAKER_02She had not moved him to the imaginary spot, and so he was still there. So this brings his imaginary friends, the magical thinking below seven, you know, all that kind of stuff really intrigues me. Who is driving that? So the in the in the shamanic tradition, in those more ancient, in, you know, the the goddesses of the Kulin Mountain, that those are driven by senses and that the sense created the organ and the organ creates the environment. So so it's a little bit like the shift in my mind when I think about going from reality to like the shifts in the brain. It's a little bit like when we used to do surgeries on people and we would have to cut big things open. Right. You know, and now they're just using for later surgeries, teeny tiny little tubes. So the recovery, most of the recovery was, you know, just the cut the tissue trauma and all that stuff. You know, now they're doing the little robotic things, you know. I can see the more so things are getting more and more and more subtle. They're moving between the realities, is what they're doing, and damaging tissue less. Right. And that's where I see the five element spirit work as being that more subtle energy, that healing is less traumatic, that you don't have these major detoxes, that you don't because all you're doing is you're taking the part of the brain and you're reconstructing that organ in a way that is healthy.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, you're restoring the congruence. Fascinating. In the middle of all that, a thought came to mind that seems kind of applicable here in in an oddball kind of way. But back in 1984, I had the opportunity to take a class with Nancy and Tappy, the life color lady. Right.
SPEAKER_02And one of the Donna's original life color teacher.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And this was in Ashland. It was kind of a fun, magical story how I got there. But uh, one of the things that I really remember her saying, because I had two of them at home, she was talking about the indigo life color, and they were all pretty young at that age. Well, one of one of mine wasn't even born yet, so I just had the one at that time. And so she's talking all about their different characteristics. And one of the things that she said that I thought was so interesting was she said that these people who are being born into this life color, we will discover that they have that that they will grow larger livers than the rest of us. Indicus? Yeah. Well, maybe that's why I can drink so much beer. Maybe.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Her theory was that it would be to take to uh account for the increase in environmental toxins, which when we compare the the environmental toxins of 1984 to 2025, I mean, wow. Huge jump that I don't think any of us could have anticipated.
SPEAKER_02But there's also adaptability that's happening.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So but this increase in adaptability and I think also increase in sight. In sight? Sight. I mean, what what what other what other influence might that exert in the system? Now I have not seen any any corroborating evidence of this, but it just popped into my head just now as we're having this conversation. And we're in the indigo age, which is so is that now gonna be liver age activated. Liver age. Somehow.
SPEAKER_02Uh the age of correcting perceptions or even even when you say cor when I say correct perceptions, that's not even right. No. That's an ass that's assuming that we we have this reality. So this this constant recreating that's happening in rejuvenation. I mean, liver is the rejuvenator. Liver is the energy of forgiveness, liver is the energy of renewal. So what is the story of the guy that kept getting his liver eaten on the side of the side of the cliff? Prometheus? Yeah. Somehow I'm feeling that that's there's something in there that's going to help us understand this better.
SPEAKER_03It's it's a it's a long-ish story, but Prometheus would get in trouble a lot with the gods because he had a soft spot for humans. So he did all kinds of things for humans that that weren't supposed to happen. He gave the humans fire. He pulled the I think this was what got him got him in trouble this time is that he uh the humans owed the gods an offering, and so they killed an ox and they and they created two bags. And Prometheus thought it would be funny to put all the bones in one bag and cover it with a nice fat, lay, you know, big thick layer of fat and all the juicy organs and stuff. And he put um, I don't know, the hooves or something on top. So one appeared really delicious, and the other one appeared less valuable. So, of course, the gods chose the one with the big layer of fat, and then they were, and then they were furious. So his punishment was to be chained to Mount Caucasus and to have an eagle come every day and eat his liver, and then during the night his liver would regenerate, and then the next day the eagle would come back and eat it again, and every night it would regenerate, etc., etc., etc., etc. So his and how he was delivered from this by one story at least, is that Chiron, the the wounded healer, got his name because he was present at a wedding feast with many of his proteges. He was the he was the mentor of many of the Greek heroes, Hercules and Achilles, and you know, all the all the big names of Greek, Greek history. He was their mentor. He taught them art of you know military arts and strategy and martial arts and healing and all kinds of things. So he's at this wedding feast, and Hercules is there, and there's other centaurs there too, who are kind of assholes. And at one point they get drunk and they decide they're gonna rape the bride. So Hercules jumps up and he's gonna, he's gonna fix this. And Chiron's trying to get the get these centaurs to stand down. So Hercules draws his bow that's tipped with the Hydra's poison, and he hits what he thinks is the one that's closest to this happening, and instead he's hit his his beloved mentor in the ankle. So Chiron becomes the wounded healer because he isn't he he's half immortal and half and half human, so he can't die from this wound. So he's in constant pain. So he travels the world looking for the remedy that will end his pa his suffering, basically. And so he amasses all of this incredible wealth of all of these different traditions of healing, but they never apply to him. They never work for him. So he goes around and you know, and he cross-pollinates all these traditions as well. So he'll use a healing technique from one area somewhere else, because they they have something, they don't have a, they don't have anything to fill the need. So he's traveling around, traveling around, but he's in constant, constant, constant pain. So apparently Hercules, who is just distraught over having created the suffering for his beloved mentor, goes to goes to Mount Olympus and brokers a trade that uh Chiron will take Prometheus' place, and that the grant the the gods will grant Chiron the ability to die from his wound. So Prometheus is is released, Chiron takes his place on Mount Caucasus, then he dies, and then Zeus takes his bones and throws them up into the heavens as the constellation Sagittarius. So that's that's my memory of the story. I mean likely I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the renewal bit, you know, the going back at night.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Just the repetition of the renewal.
SPEAKER_02I want to bring up liver here for a minute.
SPEAKER_00I have my that feels like we just talked about the offering, the handing over.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That's what Haran was doing.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, the surrender. Yeah. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00Next time, how do we get the scales to fall from our eyes so we can perceive correctly? Sarah and Deborah offer some point suggestions, particularly Liver 9, that will help hold our alignment with the radiant circuits and our correct vision. As always, thanks for listening to Put a Quarter in It, presented by Energy Medicine University and produced by Hip Chicks Create.